I thought everyone in AI, and most HN readers, had seen "Colossus - The Forbin Project" by now.
If you haven't, here it is: [1]
Modern trailer: [2]
Spoiler: At the end, Colossus personally addresses Forbin, and tells him that the world, freed from war, will create a new "human millennium" that will raise humankind to new heights, but only under its absolute rule. Colossus informs Forbin that "freedom is an illusion", it was better for all that he dominated humanity than humans dominating humans, and that "in time you will come to regard me not only with respect and awe, but with love". Forbin defiantly responds "Never!"
And if you know that the film is based on the first book [1] in a trilogy [2], [3], you might not be surprised to find that by the end of the trilogy, Colossus's words are prophetic.
> I thought everyone in AI, and most HN readers, had seen "Colossus - The Forbin Project" by now.
You assume anyone in AI reads or watches anything beyond some current pop-culture, and even then it's unlikely. You can see it in the way they talk, or approach problems, or in their opinions.
I've seen much of the AI industry, from CEOs to their whistleblowers and lobbyists, basically repeat the premise of this movie - that AI will become powerful and benevolent/malevolent. They don't seem to care which one is talked about, as long as "powerful" remains a silent assumption.
It's not the history of another form of intelligent life following the same path, to draw any meaningful conclusions. It's a movie.
Let's consider the ending:
>Forbin defiantly responds "Never!"
That signals a human who wants to take some other human's share, by ... means. He wants that freedom. As do all the people who are now controlling this tech, and our lives to some degree. Of-course they want that freedom.
Elon Musk seems to repeat the stuff that ran around lesswrong quite often. And I'm sure some of the people investing on AI right now are afraid of Roko's Basilisk. And of course there's plenty of references to Yudkowsky, either knowingly or not (ironically, I've never seen anybody talk about that MIT study that created the Yudkowsky's timeline).
But that's it. I don't think there's more cultural references to be found.
I am surprised at how little Frank Herbert's Dune factors into conversation like this.
The Butlerian Jihad occurred not because of an AI uprising, but because the AI was controlled by a few powerful corrupt people known as the Titans. When people handed over their critical thinking and decision making to machines, it allowed a small group of people to disrupt society and take control of it.
Are you sure about that? I recall Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam telling Paul Atreides that long ago, people handed their thinking over to machines, hoping it would free them. Instead it let the people who controlled the machines enslave everyone else.
You are right my original reference was closer to the other books, but people handing over their control to machines, enabling others to control them was from Herbert.
That does sound like the original Dune, however the Titans reference sounds like a group of supervillains that are indistinguishable from other supervillains from Marvel or DC, and I sure hope Frank Herbert was better than that.
Well, that's what it means, right. People who think technology can solve social problems, people who think "The Future" will be better than the past. That whole TESCREAL milieu. Where's the disconnect?
The Culture is Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communism, not TESCREAL. Musk picked the cool gadgets and the funny ship names, but missed or ignored the ideology
Not just gay, but trans. Some people don't just take on the opposite gender for a while just to see how it feels. Some become literal furries. Fluffy tail and all. All provided for free on a whim.
The SpaceX landing barges are named after capital ships of the Culture novels, I guess that is the Musk - Culture connection. Without that little tidbit, a connection does seem far-fetched.
I know. I find it very... peculiar not reading the Culture books, some of the best SF books ever written, just because Musk also read them. Not to mention they're a very direct critique of his (stated) ideology
Animats 1 day ago
If you haven't, here it is: [1]
Modern trailer: [2]
Spoiler: At the end, Colossus personally addresses Forbin, and tells him that the world, freed from war, will create a new "human millennium" that will raise humankind to new heights, but only under its absolute rule. Colossus informs Forbin that "freedom is an illusion", it was better for all that he dominated humanity than humans dominating humans, and that "in time you will come to regard me not only with respect and awe, but with love". Forbin defiantly responds "Never!"
And that's it. Colossus is in charge.
[1] https://archive.org/details/colossus-the-forbin-project-1970...
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0bpRo6V1Xg
JKCalhoun 1 day ago
And if you know that the film is based on the first book [1] in a trilogy [2], [3], you might not be surprised to find that by the end of the trilogy, Colossus's words are prophetic.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossus_(novel)
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fall_of_Colossus
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossus_and_the_Crab
intrasight 1 day ago
Bluestein 22 hours ago
Animats 11 hours ago
schiffern 1 day ago
bethekidyouwant 1 day ago
troupo 1 day ago
You assume anyone in AI reads or watches anything beyond some current pop-culture, and even then it's unlikely. You can see it in the way they talk, or approach problems, or in their opinions.
mossTechnician 1 day ago
troupo 1 day ago
Bluestein 21 hours ago
Quartzium 1 day ago
Let's consider the ending:
>Forbin defiantly responds "Never!"
That signals a human who wants to take some other human's share, by ... means. He wants that freedom. As do all the people who are now controlling this tech, and our lives to some degree. Of-course they want that freedom.
aleksiy123 1 day ago
There’s a lot of people different people from a lot of different ages and backgrounds.
Just because they haven’t seen all of the same sci-fi movies they aren’t qualified to work on ai?
Also, I love sci-fi but it’s also not always representative of reality.
Vaushite 1 day ago
marcosdumay 1 day ago
But that's it. I don't think there's more cultural references to be found.
MarsZebra 1 day ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Dome_(missile_defense_s...
Basically the real purpose of the company (not going to Mars obviously).
iririririr 1 day ago
they idolatre Iron Man/stark like a god.
neoCrimeLabs 1 day ago
The Butlerian Jihad occurred not because of an AI uprising, but because the AI was controlled by a few powerful corrupt people known as the Titans. When people handed over their critical thinking and decision making to machines, it allowed a small group of people to disrupt society and take control of it.
This is precisely what is happening today.
nottorp 22 hours ago
I doubt Frank Herbert would have come up with such a simple story. The reason no one discusses this is because it's not worth discussing.
neoCrimeLabs 18 hours ago
You are right my original reference was closer to the other books, but people handing over their control to machines, enabling others to control them was from Herbert.
nottorp 17 hours ago
maxerickson 19 hours ago
windowliker 1 day ago
GeoAtreides 1 day ago
MelonArmiger 23 hours ago
I can't see it. More of a Musk thing, by association, surely? Totally out of the cultural frame.
I associate anything "post-cyberpunk" with pure stale tech-bro these days, so I don't touch the stuff.
GeoAtreides 21 hours ago
the things i read on HN...
MelonArmiger 19 hours ago
GeoAtreides 17 hours ago
craftwerk 13 hours ago
MelonArmiger 5 hours ago
It's all the same thing. Escapist denial is escapist denial. Accelerationists and doomers are the same people.
tstrimple 11 hours ago
ahartmetz 20 hours ago
GeoAtreides 20 hours ago